Join the "Heat Haters" club now!

Actually FL you should be happy that I picked the 3  babies to win the East again and not being a Homer and saying the Bulls.

John Paxson  needs to GO!  

competitive? maybe. 2 of those 4 wins by OKC were double digit wins. the one Laker win saw LALA land shoot 41 free throws. I really dont think this series was as close as some LA fans make it out to be. Every playoff series will have close games. But next year, LALA land is a year older and further removed from their prime. OKC is still young and improving year in and year out. <br /><br />Nash makes the gap closer, i concede that point. I still dont think Nash gets LA 3 more wins in a 7 game series.

Bynum further removed from his prime? The other Lakers stars are older but are still very good basketball players. I think OKC is better as well but I don't think the Lakers are that far behind. They've done a good job addressing the PG and bench scoring weaknesses. They still need to sign another back-up swing position player. The off-season isn't over yet.

Heat fans shouldn't mentioned free throws. I didn't see many complaining about those 47 free throws in game 2 against Boston. 

The concepts you're laying out have no factual basis. It's all based on your speculation and assumption. That is what YOU are failing to grasp...

I don't fail to grasp that at all - I have no doubt that you are in complete denial about what I am, and have been, saying for quite some time now.  That you lack the same speculative, muckraking instincts, and fail to connect the dots as I have is your own shortcoming - nothing I can do about that.  Just don't play dumb with me and keep asking me to repeat myself.

It also has to do with your complete butt-hurt-ness that James won a title and has been the face of the league for quite some time. That is something that others who read this thread have "no trouble" grasping about you.

Like I said, I could care less what you or others think of me.

What's interesting to me about you Jim_Doors is the reverance you hold for James even though he never, ever gave your team - the Knicks - a fair shake with respect to his "free agency", especially being that your team probably needed him the most!

Uh-Oh, Davwy. Be prepared to be called a moron, idiot and how 66 is less than 82 which means it was much easier for the Heat to win their * title. 

Ha!  I took that into consideration, but ucfalu seems pretty rational and not looking to undercut an argument by spinning facts.   

Interesting enough, I was at a Lakers/Maverick game during the season and talked to one of the Maverick's training coaches afterward the game (He is the cousin of my friend I went to the game with).   He told me how all the injuries were due to the lack or rest of the players.  This game between the Mavs and Lakers was very low scoring, ending with each team scoring in the 70s.  I notice in the game they were playing pretty slow and missing shots.  He said it was due to lack of rest.  That's why the pacing of the game was slow and missed shots because of tired less.  Each team was basicaly walking the ball up the court.  He said it hurt older teams like the Mavericks, Spurs and Celtics more.  Though the Celtics and Spurs started pacing thier older players in previous seasons, so they knew how to prepare for the home stretch.  And unlike the Lakers, they were basically running the same offense with the same players, so the lack of practice sessions hurt them.  But the lack of rest didn't just hurt the older player, the youngers became more injury prone because minor injuries weren't allowed to heal between games like they normally would.  Older players usually don't risk the hard contact as much. (As Kobe mentioned, he doesn't take hard fouls because the constant pounding shortens careers.  Hopefully Rose and Westbrooke will stop throwing their bodies around so  much so we can enjoy their career's longer.

don't bother with simple jefe. there are idiots like kobella that raped and molest women, kobella who threatened leaving for the Clippers by forcing the hand of the flakers org (yet it was kobina who ckicked shaq out the door), dhoward that yes went "public" and caused tumult between coaches and general managers (and is still doing that), world POS who brings violence in his game... a lot of players in the Lakers, and yet simpleton jefe rants about collusion and think this is such a huge crime. he speaks of deception like simple jefe thinks he can speak for the city of bum crap cleveland, which btw is the only city that was "deceived". he is  fan of a team full of both deceptive morons (ask kobe's wife vanessa) and public displays of embarrassment (ask world piece of crap). 

for these two faker fans chiefs and simple jefe it is best to just let them cry in a small dark corner, their kobe and nash figurines assisting them in what they do best. i love it when the Heat championship and the alliance of the three Kings have gotten deep into these two sad faker fans that all thats left for them is debating uselessly in this thread. there is fear among these fakers that the heat is a dynasty in the making. players will all want to play with the heat for less to win and we have that advantage now. this is where jealousy strikes at the hearts of these two poor excuses of basketball fans.

yeah, kobina is a coward by saying he doesn't want to throw his body around, lol, no wonder he relies on big all star centers to protect him. d rose and westbrook should just have to play smart but fearless if they want to win. kobessa's advice is crap and he only said that to cover his old age. he tried to take charges in his series with okc and guess what because he has been a coward hiding behing his centers and other players (ask world piece of crap, kobe's anointed "one whom he could trust"), he doesn't know how to. that's pure cowardice. this day an age, players are more athletic, and there is a lot of physicality. u have to sacrifice ur body  sometimes to win.

Jefe101,

Not much more I can say about your (seems to be) radical thoughts.   You don't care whatever people think, so I am going to give it a rest.

Now about which team will win the 2012-2013 season, do you have a favorite team or is it whoever win will be the team you pick?

 

The 3 older teams that will have negative impact with long season are San Antonio, LA Lakers and Boston.   So looks like OKC will be favored coming out of the West?

I agree younger are at an advantage as the season drives on, but that's with all things being equal.  Usually older teams compensate for it in some ways like the Spurs and Celtics usually do.  The plan was to rest Kobe more during the season as Phil Jackson did the previous season, but with injuries to other players and such, that didn't happen when they were fighting for seeding in a tough West.  With extra scorers on the team like Nash and Jamison, it will be easier to find rest for Kobe, though the team still needs to acquire a back-up shooting guard.  And cosidering the older team won the 5 of the last 4 Finals (Heat over Thunder, Mavericks over Heat, Lakers over Celtics (exception), Lakers over Magic, Celtics over Lakers), I would say experience is a bigger factor than youth.

It maybe a little easier for Miami as most EC teasm are on the east coast.   There are only 5 teams on the West Coast, while most of WC team are in between.  

I'm not claiming that the Heat will have a harder time repeating than the Lakers because of travel.  It's more of a comparison to the Bulls and how extra travel is more ware on a team.  Phil Jackson could perceive the differenc the toll took on each team because he experience the mid-west travel and the coastal travel times.   Miami travels more than other Eastern teams because further south in the hemisphere.  I think the travel time between Portland and Miami is the greatest of all the teams.  But you are correct, West Coast teams travel the most, espeicially with OKC on the schedule.  The Norht East teams have the best schedule, as they are bunched.  But Phil's point was more toward people thinking repeating isnt that hard, and but he was pointing out to two advantages that team had over the Lakers.  Also, when he made that statement, the Lakers had been to 3 straight Finals and the talk was about going to the 4th which the Bulls never did.  Jackson wasn't able to get the Kobe/Shaq or Kobe/Gasol to pass 3 straight either.

K. Bryant as you indicated, to me shows a strong will to win.   However, it maybe negative sometimes as he seems much more selfish, taking bad/low percentage shot and at the same time throwing his teammates under the bus.   Even in the later two NBA champ seasons, he was having bad games and taking many bad shots, luckily the 4, 5 big guys (Bynum, Gasol, Odom, Artest, Ariza) was able to offset Kobe's mistakes with much higher shooting percentages and obscene rebounding numbers.

I think you may have bit of a bias here as many people who watch all the Laker's game.  When Laker players are reluctant to shoot, Kobe will shoot more because he looses faith his teammates.   World Peace addresses a few weeks ago on the local ESPN radion show.  Kobe's shooting wasn't the subject matter, but he was talking about the attitudes of the players when they play for a player like Kobe.  And his comment seem to allude towards Ramon Session's play.

World Peace mentioned when he first came to the Lakers, he was in awe of playing with Kobe, and his mentality was to get the ball to Kobe and watch what he does.  He said that's what many of the younger players are doing.  He mentioned that in the last playoffs, he realized you can't always wait and see what Kobe will do, so when go the ball he was very aggressive and didn't worry about.  When you look at the last playoffs, you will see the only other player who played as hungry as Kobe was Metta.  And Kobe many times get's frustrated by thier lack of aggression.  All that leads to is a double team on Kobe.  Some none Laker fans seem to miss how Nash is someone Kobe wants and that a few years back, the player he was pushing for was Jason Kidd.  Kobe wants someone who will do something with the ball.  When the Nash deal was done, Kobe mention how now he will be able to take open shots, instead of those low percentage shots that many non-laker fans think Kobe enjoys doing.

And by the way, go back and look at the game tracking of those games where everyone seems to think that Artest, Gasol, Odom, Artest and Ariza were the heros of those games.   The professing that Gasol was the MVP of the series is really astounishing and shows how non-laker fans can will conclude that Kobe had an awful game and give credit to others when the facts say otherwise.  For some reason people seem to think Gasol had the great series and in Game 7 against the Celtics, he was the hero.  It's really strange.

L. James on the other hand may not have all the feistiness that Kobe has, and at one point being ridiculed as choker or soft of bum etc.... It's a different mentality as his hunger to win is creating easier shots for his teammate.   Either way, there is hunger, in which way it maybe better - who knows.   But no, K. Bryant is not anymore hunger than other elite players trying to establish their identity.

You're making this about Kobe verus Lebron, when I was mearly pointing out how Jamison saw the behavior of many players after winning.  And as I said, we don't know about Lebron or Bosh, because that scenario begins now.  Coaches and teammates can't make a player hungry.  They can motivate players, but hunger is a mentality they have to bring themselves.  But I would point to Laker players who seemed less hungry after winning championships.  That's why new blood seems to help.  The 80s Lakers always had new blood, but thier core seem to have a different mentality.

Also, Lebron's "creating easier shots" comes more out of him being more of a point forward and his different approach at the game.  Lebron plays with a point guard mentality while Kobe is more of a shooter.  In an Olympic interview, Kobe pointed the difference in leadership skills of him and Lebron.  Kobe said he was more of a person who would get in your face and tell you what's wrong, while Lebron is more of a gatherer, where he will gather the team, and seach for an answer.  They balance each out each other.  Kobe is more like Jordan, who didn't mince words on the court.  MJ sure didn't give Kwame Brown confidence.  He Nash pointed out how he would balance out Kobe, saying Kobe is more  of a drill sergent, while he is more of the talker.  They just have different approaches and I think Lebron's personality fits his style of play, which is more like a Magic than a Jordan.

At the same time, you cannot overlooked the monetary sacrifices that all these Miami guys made - to be able to bring a championship caliber team together. 

I think this is a bit overblown, as it's used to paint the guys as being a bit noble in their cause.  First off, we're not talking about the choice of playing basketball or joining the military and serving your country.  We are talking about men who have already made 10's of millions of dollars deciding to take a little bit less money which will have zero affect on their lifestyle or financial sercurity. 

For example, Chris Bosh. made close to 15.8 million dollars his last season with Toronto.  His first season with the Heat he made 14.5 million dollars.  A pay cut?  Well, when you consider Bosh had to pay a higher Canadian tax than he does playing in Miami, that included Canadian federal taxes, Ontario province taxes (zero in Florida), the 13 percent sales tax (twice as much a Florida), and a few other Canadian taxes that are required, and then on top of that, he still had to pay federal income tax in the United States and a state tax depending on what state he was a residence of (though, tha may have been Texas, which has no state tax).  Over the life of the 110 dollar contract, Bosh is making more money than he would have with his last employer.  And unless he played in Texas, he would not have gotten the tax break he's getting in Florida

Lebron was making the same as Bosh was in Canada, but the tax hit was less in Michigan, and Lebron probably loses about 10 million in salary over the life of the contract compared to Wade, with 15.

But, let's be real.  We are talking about guys who had already made over 55 million dollars and playing basketball, and with Wade and Lebron, toss in endorsments, it was over 100 million dollars.  Bosh is probably getting more endoresments now than he ever has and James and Wade were already near the top of their scales.  The hold argument of taking pay cuts is nonsense.  Their lives would not have changed in the slightest if they have taking more money, so, really, what's the sacrifice?

"If you don't agree with me, that's fine - just say so - but stop trying to engage me in debate, especially if you lack requisite reading comprehension skills, because I'm tired of having to re-state my convictions over. and over, and over again!"



Dear Jefe,

You are near as smart as you think you are. Quite honeslty, you are nonsenical.


1. You have told us 1000x about your collusion theory, although you admit you have as much proof as the other idiots eith the alien lotto theories.
We know it was in your mind a 'secret' when actaully the PLAYERS talking was no secret at all. Do you not think for a minute that this current group of Olympians is not talking in the exact same way? It took K. Love all of a few days to decide that if the T Wolves don't become a winner that he wants to play for one. That fact that years later it worked out that James/Wade/Bosh are all playing together is because they all happened to be in no win situations so change was necessary if they wanted to win and Riley was the only man smart enough to made sure he had the cap space in case it was needed. Dan Gilbert gave up a long time ago and many dollars ago. Time for you to move on yet?


2. How  many times are you going to tell us (Heat fans) that you question why we are here?  Guess what? This is a public site, a public thread. As you can see by some of the welcome new faces here, that it is possible to have decent and fair discussion without  all of the nonsense, regardless of which team you are a fan of.

If you want a private hate club with the other couple of Bozo's that you choose to associate with, no matter how stupid the posts are, and don't want to rebuttal, I suggest you exchange emails and form you own private club of idiocy.



3. As far as your ridiculous "one and done" claim , please explain how  that correlates us into having to make a field bet with you in order to prove anything?

Your claim came out of your mouth unprovoked. It wasn't like any Heat fan was guaranteeing anything.  We were discussing the additions of Allen/Lewis which DID make the Heat better. Nothing more, nothing less.

For you to proclaim the Heat can't win, should indicate that you have a strong opinion of who will win.  

If that is the case you should have said that your opinion is the Heat cant win because of reasons A,B,C,.....etc....which leads you to believe that team ? is better then the Heat and then if you want to bet, offer to take that team even up.
  
Instead you offer some stats on past history which mean ZERO today.

Then you try to twist it into saying whoever challenged you is saying the Heat can't lose and should offer you the field in a bet nearly 10+ months away.  That is ASS backwards in every way.



You remind me of the kid we all new in high school that had some book smarts, but not an ounce of common sense.    


    

   

"Evidently not, according to our logical, unbiased, common sense driven resident thread clown..."


I never said the Clippers HAVE to win the division but I give them a GREAT chance.
I said I was willing to defy the odds (even though those odds have nothing to do with the division) and take the Clippers even up. 

CL already cowered and wouldn't make a simple avi bet (we know he has the heart and the courage of a lion).


It's out there for any other Laker fan (but Jefe, who doesn't honor avi bets) if they want.   


       

1. You have told us 1000x about your collusion theory, although you admit you have as much proof as the other idiots eith the alien lotto theories

I think the lack of proof is what makes it a THOERY.  Just sayin.   Tossing that out there.

"No, not really.  I would consider the changes that the Lakers have made so far going into next season to emblematic of "substantial improvement".  At the beginning of the off-season, there were three glaring deficiencies:
1. The point guard position
2. Lack of scoring off the bench
3. A solid backup shooter/defender in the back-court

So far, the Lakers have legitimately addressed two of the three; the point guard position (Nash) and scoring off the bench (Jamison).  I believe the Lakers are still going to end up addressing item #3 at some point before camp opens up, either using their miniMLE or by issuing another vet min contract for the likes of someone along the lines of a Jodie Meeks, Carlos Delfino, Mickael Pietrus, or the like.

The only thing stopping the Lakers from making that last move is this ongoing business that still is the pursuit of Dwight Howard, which may or may not come with the added burden (or asset, depending on your point of view) that is taking on Jason Richardson's contract.

In any event, I would consider the changes that the Lakers have already made as being substantial enough to vault them into legit title contention.  If they end up getting Howard, I would upgrade "contention" to "favorites"."



However you really don't believe any of this or the man so hard looking to bet would rest on these laurels and take this team vs the Heat.

Instead, you want all other 29.    


 " But, hey, as turnip and flauge are fond of saying, "you gotta do whatever it takes to win" -"



Really?? I said that??  Never. No way.


Please don't put words in my mouth.       

I would say those are more your thoughts since you openly and publicy wished serious  injury on a  athlete, a total stranger to you.

That was probably the most pathetic thing you ever uttered here


".Ring chasing free agent superstars conspiring with Heat mgmt to gang up with eachother, to the exclusion of any other team realistically being in a position to acquire them..."



But hey, I'm still pissed at Stern for not handing us Paul and letting us have the cap space to also go after Howard!! Both players still under contract.

In other and better words, Your just pissed because the Heat became better then at that time 2 time champs in a matter of a couple days. 



" To me, it still resonates to this day."

For sure. It was probably the worst thing to happen in the world in the last 2 years. GOD are you F'D up. 



 "Kobe "threatening to be traded" was power play and posturing designed to do one thing, and one thing only - get his team to take formative action to help him win now and restore his team's championship luster"



And THIS is just another reason as to why we can all laugh at you.  




  my loathing of the Heat has everything to do with how different    much better they are then  the Lakers!

      


  

"I think the lack of proof is what makes it a THOERY.  Just sayin.   Tossing that out there"



I think that people that try to convince other  people that unproven theories are the basis of their reason of hate vs some stranger athletes for 2 + years would have to be a complete idiot.   Just sayin. Tossing that out there.

"fk your consensus, or anyone else's for that matter - I'm saying this Heat team is One and Done!  Hello, is this thing on?  Am I speaking in a language that you can understand??  Testing...one...two...three...Testi

ng...

If you're saying otherwise, you're saying the Heat are going to repeat - so, just say it!!!"




Jefe, please read this, then pretend you didn't write it so you can be unbiased, and then let it sink in how stupid it is.     

just stoping by to say hello to all the wonderful haters on here lol.. Go Heat 2012 NBA CHAMPS!!!

10,000th post!

1. You have told us 1000x about your collusion theory, although you admit you have as much proof as the other idiots eith the alien lotto theories...That fact that years later it worked out that James/Wade/Bosh are all playing together is because they all happened to be in no win situations so change was necessary if they wanted to win and Riley was the only man smart enough to made sure he had the cap space in case it was needed.

..."in case it was needed" - that's very funny turnip!  You better believe it was needed - the "case" was made way before your "Three Kings" became "free agents".  Their talking about it years before "Yes.We.Did" was no secret, but their committing to Riley while they were still under contract with their respective teams sure was.  Yeah, Riley sure was so smart!  How amazingly prescient of him!

Wow!  turnip. leave it to you to find a way to make my own case!

2. How  many times are you going to tell us (Heat fans) that you question why we are here?  Guess what? This is a public site, a public thread. As you can see by some of the welcome new faces here, that it is possible to have decent and fair discussion without  all of the nonsense, regardless of which team you are a fan of.

Hey, if you want to devote your entire existence within the CBS Sports online community squatting here on the "Heat Haters" club thread, be my guest - whatever floats your boat, turnip!  I just think it's pretty hilarious.

3. As far as your ridiculous "one and done" claim , please explain how  that correlates us into having to make a field bet with you in order to prove anything?...For you to proclaim the Heat can't win, should indicate that you have a strong opinion of who will win.

No, not at all.  Any one of a small handful of teams stand in their way.  History has taught us that you have got to be an exceptional team to repeat as NBA Champions in the modern era - it is my contention that your Miami Heat are NOT one of those teams, sorry... hence "One And Done".  I'm saying they will not repeat...twocoach (God bless him) says they will.  What say you, turnip?

You remind me of the kid we all new in high school that had some book smarts, but not an ounce of common sense.

You remind me of the village idiot.

"To me, it still resonates to this day."

For sure. It was probably the worst thing to happen in the world in the last 2 years. GOD are you F'D up.

..."the worst thing to happen in the world"???  Relax, all I said was that the folly of "The Decision" still resonates with me today.

"I think the lack of proof is what makes it a THEORY.  Just sayin.   Tossing that out there"

I think that people that try to convince other people that unproven theories are the basis of their reason of hate vs some stranger athletes for 2 + years would have to be a complete idiot.

It's a single theory, turnip...and it's just one of three or four reasons why I loathe the Heat.  Not sure what "vs some stranger athletes" means though...

But don't let me slow you down, village idiot.

10,000th post!

Curses!

 "I'm saying they will not repeat...twocoach (God bless him) says they will.  What say you, turnip?"

I would easily be willing to go out on a limb and say that my opinion is a Heat team at full strength (healthy Big 3) will beat any other team 4/7 times.

There is simply NO reason to not believe it as of TODAY. The rich got richer. While other teams also improved, I don't see where anyone moved ahead of us.

In your rants, I have seen no EVIDENCE or REASONS  to support your opinion as to why you feel the Heat will lose other then some historical stats (wihich mean ZERO in as far as having to do with this Heat team).

I also saw all of the travel and distance posts as well but I contend that affects the outcome of regualr season games and has little or nothing to do with playoff games.


Let's here in your opinion (or anyone elses) the top 3 teams you feel can/will knock of the Heat and why.



 "History has taught us that you have got to be an exceptional team to repeat as NBA Champions in the modern era - it is my contention that your Miami Heat are NOT one of those teams, sorry... hence "One And Done"."


You pretty much have backed yourself in a corner with exceptional team stuff. In other words, if the Heat win again this season (not that your asterik opinions matter) there is nothing you can say that would deflect how wise the decision of the Big 3 to unite was to all involved.


So, since you want to bet on something so bad, how about this?

If the Heat win, you write a (whatever it takes) 300-500 word synopsis praising the Heat, James, and all others involved explaining (in all positive ways) how they have risen to be champions, what makes them exceptional, etc., etc...

If they lose, I will write the same type of thing pointing out their shortcomings or whatever you choose as the topic.